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Even in the mma world in some fights you will see that a top notch grappler a BJJ black belt still get dominated on the mat, especially if they’re dealing with an opponent that is much bigger or stronger than them. For instance a few nights ago I watched the bloody, brutal, and seemingly eternal UFC 5 round match between Mark Hunt and Antonio “Bigfoot” Silva. The fight ended in a draw after 5 rounds because the judges we’re split on who really won and both guys looked equally battered and fucked up after it was over. Both fighters had moments where one man dominated and the other man was simply trying to survive and at other times it was a spectacular show of both men exchanging and throwing and taking brutal strikes from one another like steel tempered champions. It was one of the best if not the best fights I’ve seen in the UFC, because both men showed extreme heart and determination and skill and fought with everything they had till the bitter end. However, the point I’m trying to get to is there was a moment in the fight where Mark Hunt 5’10 and 265 pounds was dominating Antonio Silva also 265 pounds but 6’4. Antonio is a very skilled at submissions and experienced grappler and BJJ expert, however Mark was on top of Antonio grounding and pounding the shit out of him with elbows and fists cutting his face to pieces and Antonio was just trying to survive and defend himself and pull off a submission or escape as best he could but only found reprieve when the bell rang at the end of the 3rd round, he was literally saved by the bell. If not for that it seemed like if the fight had of been allowed to continue as was it would’ve ended in either a TKO or ref stoppage. In theory BJJ should have allowed him to be able to escape his opponents punishment and pull off an armbar or triangle choke or some other submission on Mark but this is not how it went down.
The point is grappling and submissions only work well when you have a size or strength advantage over your opponent or you are both equal in those terms and even then in the heat off a fight and eating strikes you still have to be very skilled to pull it out. Hell in this case both fighters were even the same size in weight, but Mark while he is obese and not as fast or conditioned as his opponent because of his stocky build does posses more raw power and strength than Bigfoot and why he was able to dominate him so well at that point in the fight. And if we see this happening in mma fights then it tells us volumes about how grappling is even less effective when you’re in the fight of your life on the street when there are no rules or refs, your rolling around outside on asphalt or rocks possibly even broken glass, and nobody is there to stop your attacker from pulling a weapon or his buddies from coming over to give you boots even if you are able to dominate him. People are wrong when they say size or strength doesn’t matter in a fight, especially a regulated fight with rules when the fight goes to the mat. But with the SDTS tactics we are taught how to use down and dirty and otherwise illegal in sport techniques such as biting, eye gouging, hitting or ripping “illegal” areas like the groin or throat, edge of hand strikes, and best of all if you can pull out or find whatever you can use as a weapon and stab, beat, strangle, or shoot the fuck out of them. Taking this into consideration yes size and strength become much less of a factor in your opponents ability to dominate you and anybody can defeat anybody, but despite what the Gracies or Machados may tell you grappling is not and never will be the solution to neutralize your opponent. As Damian says “Train Honestly” people
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Nice post [Dallas Williams].
Grappling is an inefficient method of defense. The reason it’s so popular is because you can tell, right away if you can defeat your opponent while still remaining friends.
I can make you tap without really hurting you, but I can;t knock you out without doing some real damage.
That’s why martial arts evolved into dancing and grappling remained constant. That’s also the reason people are convinced BJJ and other forms of grappling are great because they have “proof” that it works. when you get your partner to tap – you know you’ve won.
But as you pointed out – while you’re trying to get some guy to tap, he’s going to be beating the crap out of you.
It’s much easier to knock someone out with a strike than it is a strangle. It’s even easier with a black jack
If you can get someone to “tap” you have the power to knock someone out.
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Yeah I remember watching one of Antonio Nogueira’s fights, like all of the other Brazilians he’s a BJJ black belt, and after submitting Tim Sylvia with a guillotine choke he said what he loved about Gracie jiu jitsu is it allows you to be able to beat your opponent without hurting him. WTF? I thought the whole point of fighting mma is wanting to hurt guys, literally fuck them up while still doing it in the legal confines of sport and getting money and fame for it in the process. If you don’t have that mindset you have no business fighting mma, boxing, or any other combat sport or as we know especially training self defense. Another light heavyweight mma fighter Rashad Evans once said that if you wanna be a great mma fighter you gotta train hard and be skilled but above all else you have to have that aggressiveness that desire to wanna get in there and hurt people or you’re not gonna be any good period. Same thing with Iron Mike Tyson he was good because obviously he was powerful, fast, elusive, and all that but above all else he was just plain evil in the ring and wanted nothing more than to literally beat his opponents into oblivion and knock them the fuck out, not winning by looking good to the judges or scoring points. There’s a lot of truth to that, I know mma and fighting for self defense are different but in this sense they are both the same, you fight with everything you’ve got to win and walk away to live another day not fuck around and play patacakes or dry hump with your opponent or attacker. Now there are times and places for it that I grapple or play fight etc. when I’m goofing around with my buddies or me and a girl are playing around in bed, but when shit gets real I’m not messing around and I’m on them like a sewing machine needle hard, fast, and continuous until the threat is obliterated.
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@Dallas Williams said:
Now there are times and places for it that I grapple or play fight etc. when I’m goofing around with a girl are playing around in bed, but when shit gets real I’m not messing around and I’m on them like a sewing machine needle hard, fast, and continuous until the threat is obliterated.
Or until orgasm is achieved. Haha
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@Archie said:Or until orgasm is achieved. Haha
Well then it’s only a 5 second fight anyway.
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@Damian Ross said:
@Archie said:Or until orgasm is achieved. Haha
Well then it’s only a 5 second fight anyway.
Isn’t that long enough haha
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@Dallas Williams said:
Haha no it’s not but Damian is trying to work on that. But we ain’t gonna tell Angela about this
Haha
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I feel that there are situations were grappling may come in handy ,such as law enforcement etc….I have police buddies who train in judo ,which has great pinning techniques since police are often working within the law of proper force however for the common person whose job is not to engage striking should always be part of the syllabus due to the fact that it is the quickess way to learn how to defend yourself ,example if someone is in my face trying to intimidate or hurt me and I can strike in the eye maybe it justs pissed the guy off however if I can drive it half inch in his eye socket it will at least stop the attack which can provide a chance to escape ,get help,scream fire whatever or run! Being a former shaolin chuan fa practitioner I always appreciated the animal techniques (such as tiger claw also found in the sdts syllabus) because of their simplicity and effectivenesss and their design to attack the nervous system of the body.
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@–Omer.Kishanov– said:
I feel that there are situations were grappling may come in handy ,such as law enforcement etc….I have police buddies who train in judo ,which has great pinning techniques since police are often working within the law of proper force however for the common person whose job is not to engage striking should always be part of the syllabus due to the fact that it is the quickess way to learn how to defend yourself ,example if someone is in my face trying to intimidate or hurt me and I can strike in the eye maybe it justs pissed the guy off however if I can drive it half inch in his eye socket it will at least stop the attack which can provide a chance to escape ,get help,scream fire whatever or run! Being a former shaolin chuan fa practitioner I always appreciated the animal techniques (such as tiger claw also found in the sdts syllabus) because of their simplicity and effectivenesss and their design to attack the nervous system of the body.
Omer, judo is great for those throws and pins as you will see in mod 10. Mater of fact Damian has said I. We suplement anything with SDTS it would be judo. It teaches you to stay on your feet. Personally I wish I would have know that years ago with I trained in BJJ. For a while there I thought it was good to take them to the ground because of what I was taught inside a ring. But we her at SDTS know the ground is the worse place to end up.
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Omer,
You are correct. There are certainly times when we have to be more “gentle” in order to facilitate an arrest. I generally teach my guys a sort of stair-step process with presence and verbal judo being the lowest level, followed by arrest and control procedures (like you are describing here)… but make no mistake, when the shit hits the fan there is nothing more effective than full on SDTS. At the end of the day, it’s all about going home at the end of the shift.
Having said that, I gotta say, I have found less and less need to supplement my training with anything else. I’m a Krav Maga guy from way back, but even that has pretty much been replaced by SDTS. The great thing about Damian’s system is that it covers everything. I don’t need much in the “grappling” area because he has already covered what really works in the street. Same goes for takedowns, striking, etc. If you take a look at his Guardian Defensive Tactics program for law enforcement, it’s basically a more department-policy friendly version of SDTS, and it is extremely effective. Like I said, I’m finding myself using less and less of other styles and police defensive tactics systems… I just don’t need it. I can assure you this stuff works; I use it regularly.
Stay safe.
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@Archie said:
Didn’t we learn some of that in one of the mods. I remember seeing that somewhere haha. Great tactics for police work.
You are correct. There is very little “new” material in GDT, but Damian just teaches it differently, making sure that things like Use of Force policies and whatnot are included… things that a civilian using SDTS to protect themselves would not necessarily need or be interested in. The techniques are pretty much the same in the two systems, only how and when to apply is slightly different because, as mentioned, sometimes we have to be a little more “gentle” so as not to get sued.
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It sucks James that the liberals have cracked down so much on you guys where police are always getting sued or getting fired for using “excessive force”. I don’t like to hurt people anymore than anybody else when it’s not necessary but if your life is being threatened then you guys should have every bit as much of a right to defend yourselves as we civilians without fear of repercussions. It pisses me off when I always hear of cops being suspended with or without pay “pending investigation” because they had to shoot somebody who was trying to kill them or threatening them with a weapon. I mean you have a split second to make a decision under the stress of such situations and you make the wrong one and your dead but on the other hand if you make the other choice your job or even freedom is in jeopardy. It’s rediculous these days how criminal suspects have more rights than officers do and the second police have to use force to arrest a suspect who’s fighting them or even simply defending their own life people start screaming police brutality. All you have to do is put yourself in that officer’s shoes and imagine yourself in the situation he or she was in at the time and would you have acted any differently with only milliseconds to decide to do whatever it is you need to do. The point is if people would cooperate with police and not try to fight or resist them and sure as hell not pull a weapon on them they wouldn’t have anything to worry about. Nobody whens when people try to fight or flee from police if you think you’ve been wrongly arrested or charged the time to fight it is in court not on the streets.
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